Questions about AR pistols?

[Gunsmokin]

Ok, does that mean carrying your pistol out in the open is a right, but inside your waistband is not?

[Tyler]

An infringement of a right does not invalidate that right.

I think it's just about priorities. Would you stop buying Jordans and rice rockets if there was an arbitrary hurdle in your way? No one likes having to play the ATF game, but some choose to enjoy what they can regardless of the obstacles.

The braces and blades don't make it legal to shoulder your pistol(which is absurd on its own), it's just an easier/cheaper way around the hurdle.

[Gunsmokin]

An infringement of a right does not invalidate that right.

I think it's just about priorities. Would you stop buying Jordans and rice rockets if there was an arbitrary hurdle in your way? No one likes having to play the ATF game, but some choose to enjoy what they can regardless of the obstacles.

The braces and blades don't make it legal to shoulder your pistol(which is absurd on its own), it's just an easier/cheaper way around the hurdle.

Aaannnnnndddddd, tomorrow, the ATF could decide those are a buttstock. You would have a real problem then.

[kokopelli]

7" 5.56, with a Hawg muzzle device that just sticks out of a rail; loads of fun. Shockwave blade is the way to go.

[jackalo626]

Ok, does that mean carrying your pistol out in the open is a right, but inside your waistband is not?

The way you carry or what you carry should not even be a factor but it is. I have to have the concealed carry for many reasons over open carry but the only way to carry concealed weapons is to do that so I choose to do that. Do I think it is right of them to infringe upon me, no. The big difference in the comparison is guys want these "cool toy" guns mainly and that is the only kind you are paying for permission to have. It isn't like the concealed carry list says I have to pay to carry only select few guns but that I can't carry any gun concealed or knives, brass knuckles etc. I am not paying to carry "modified" guns but any guns. I am not telling anyone else to not do it but am telling you I don't and why. It always gets everybody mad but hey I've been doing it my whole life.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

[jackalo626]

An infringement of a right does not invalidate that right.

I think it's just about priorities. Would you stop buying Jordans and rice rockets if there was an arbitrary hurdle in your way? No one likes having to play the ATF game, but some choose to enjoy what they can regardless of the obstacles.

The braces and blades don't make it legal to shoulder your pistol(which is absurd on its own), it's just an easier/cheaper way around the hurdle.

The jordan thing is mainly a joke just so you guys know. I have bought one pair in the last few years and mainly wear adidas or boots (just in case others don't know it's an exaggeration). Cars or bikes if that is the rice rockets you are referring to are not a right so once again that is all privilege and we pay Hella taxes on them and continue to pay yearly taxes on property you already own and paid sales tax on which is a scam. I could stand up and fight the man by not driving but that wouldn't change it and walking everywhere would suck so I do it. Not having a car would be a huge inconvenience but not having an ar with a 4 inch shorter barrel doesn't mean shit to me honestly. Actually I have short barrel rifles already, I call them pistols You are correct about the stocks and braces being ridiculous and I agree like crazy. I've said before and I'll keep telling it, you can't legislate morality. Telling someone they can't or have to pay to own a 10in, ar doesn't make them less dangerous or make them dangerous if they do. Criminals are criminals by definition for not following laws. Like some moron has ever walked away from a crime because he couldn't get an nfa item or didn't kill someone because he couldn't have the gun he wanted. It's all a scam.

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[Gunsmokin]

Ok, does that mean carrying your pistol out in the open is a right, but inside your waistband is not?

The way you carry or what you carry should not even be a factor but it is. I have to have the concealed carry for many reasons over open carry but the only way to carry concealed weapons is to do that so I choose to do that. Do I think it is right of them to infringe upon me, no. The big difference in the comparison is guys want these "cool toy" guns mainly and that is the only kind you are paying for permission to have. It isn't like the concealed carry list says I have to pay to carry only select few guns but that I can't carry any gun concealed or knives, brass knuckles etc. I am not paying to carry "modified" guns but any guns. I am not telling anyone else to not do it but am telling you I don't and why. It always gets everybody mad but hey I've been doing it my whole life.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

So, the "Fee" you pay for the "right" to concealed carry is ok? The reason I decided to get into the NFA world is not about "cool toys," but they are cool. The way I think about it is, the more people who have these types of items, the more commonplace it becomes, the more likely the argument that it needs to be less regulated becomes easier to make. Look at suppressors, there is a movement to make them an item you can walk into the LGS and purchase as easy as a pistol or rifle. I don't believe it is likely in my lifetime that it will be that easy, but incremental moves toward that goal is a win for all of us. You cannot look at what has happened in the last couple years and not at least think that these things are more and more common.

[jackalo626]

Ok, does that mean carrying your pistol out in the open is a right, but inside your waistband is not?

The way you carry or what you carry should not even be a factor but it is. I have to have the concealed carry for many reasons over open carry but the only way to carry concealed weapons is to do that so I choose to do that. Do I think it is right of them to infringe upon me, no. The big difference in the comparison is guys want these "cool toy" guns mainly and that is the only kind you are paying for permission to have. It isn't like the concealed carry list says I have to pay to carry only select few guns but that I can't carry any gun concealed or knives, brass knuckles etc. I am not paying to carry "modified" guns but any guns. I am not telling anyone else to not do it but am telling you I don't and why. It always gets everybody mad but hey I've been doing it my whole life.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

So, the "Fee" you pay for the "right" to concealed carry is ok? The reason I decided to get into the NFA world is not about "cool toys," but they are cool. The way I think about it is, the more people who have these types of items, the more commonplace it becomes, the more likely the argument that it needs to be less regulated becomes easier to make. Look at suppressors, there is a movement to make them an item you can walk into the LGS and purchase as easy as a pistol or rifle. I don't believe it is likely in my lifetime that it will be that easy, but incremental moves toward that goal is a win for all of us. You cannot look at what has happened in the last couple years and not at least think that these things are more and more common.

No its not ok and I explicitly said that ("Do I think it is right of them to infringe upon me, no.") I said that I was forced to do that or not carry at all vs committing a crime. Not buying a permission slip for a few inch shorter barrel doesn't hinder me shooting any of the many guns I own or want to own. I wish I could join in on your belief of it being commonplace so it would be accepted but we are one election and current generation away from losing lots more gun rights if not all gun rights and then you know where this leads.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

[Gunsmokin]

Ok, does that mean carrying your pistol out in the open is a right, but inside your waistband is not?

The way you carry or what you carry should not even be a factor but it is. I have to have the concealed carry for many reasons over open carry but the only way to carry concealed weapons is to do that so I choose to do that. Do I think it is right of them to infringe upon me, no. The big difference in the comparison is guys want these "cool toy" guns mainly and that is the only kind you are paying for permission to have. It isn't like the concealed carry list says I have to pay to carry only select few guns but that I can't carry any gun concealed or knives, brass knuckles etc. I am not paying to carry "modified" guns but any guns. I am not telling anyone else to not do it but am telling you I don't and why. It always gets everybody mad but hey I've been doing it my whole life.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

So, the "Fee" you pay for the "right" to concealed carry is ok? The reason I decided to get into the NFA world is not about "cool toys," but they are cool. The way I think about it is, the more people who have these types of items, the more commonplace it becomes, the more likely the argument that it needs to be less regulated becomes easier to make. Look at suppressors, there is a movement to make them an item you can walk into the LGS and purchase as easy as a pistol or rifle. I don't believe it is likely in my lifetime that it will be that easy, but incremental moves toward that goal is a win for all of us. You cannot look at what has happened in the last couple years and not at least think that these things are more and more common.

No its not ok and I explicitly said that ("Do I think it is right of them to infringe upon me, no.") I said that I was forced to do that or not carry at all vs committing a crime. Not buying a permission slip for a few inch shorter barrel doesn't hinder me shooting any of the many guns I own or want to own. I wish I could join in on your belief of it being commonplace so it would be accepted but we are one election and current generation away from losing lots more gun rights if not all gun rights and then you know where this leads.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

The rationale for doing what you do isn't what I'm getting at. What I'm asking you, Jack, is that you said if there is a fee, it's not a right. You pay a fee to CC. Is CC a right? You say about the "fee" that you're forced to pay it. I don't believe you are. You have choices. You could open carry. You could move to a state with constitutional carry. It's about one thing with a fee being not a right, and another thing with a fee still being a right. I don't think it is both ways. Just get a suppressor.

[jackalo626]

Ok, does that mean carrying your pistol out in the open is a right, but inside your waistband is not?

The way you carry or what you carry should not even be a factor but it is. I have to have the concealed carry for many reasons over open carry but the only way to carry concealed weapons is to do that so I choose to do that. Do I think it is right of them to infringe upon me, no. The big difference in the comparison is guys want these "cool toy" guns mainly and that is the only kind you are paying for permission to have. It isn't like the concealed carry list says I have to pay to carry only select few guns but that I can't carry any gun concealed or knives, brass knuckles etc. I am not paying to carry "modified" guns but any guns. I am not telling anyone else to not do it but am telling you I don't and why. It always gets everybody mad but hey I've been doing it my whole life.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

So, the "Fee" you pay for the "right" to concealed carry is ok? The reason I decided to get into the NFA world is not about "cool toys," but they are cool. The way I think about it is, the more people who have these types of items, the more commonplace it becomes, the more likely the argument that it needs to be less regulated becomes easier to make. Look at suppressors, there is a movement to make them an item you can walk into the LGS and purchase as easy as a pistol or rifle. I don't believe it is likely in my lifetime that it will be that easy, but incremental moves toward that goal is a win for all of us. You cannot look at what has happened in the last couple years and not at least think that these things are more and more common.

No its not ok and I explicitly said that ("Do I think it is right of them to infringe upon me, no.") I said that I was forced to do that or not carry at all vs committing a crime. Not buying a permission slip for a few inch shorter barrel doesn't hinder me shooting any of the many guns I own or want to own. I wish I could join in on your belief of it being commonplace so it would be accepted but we are one election and current generation away from losing lots more gun rights if not all gun rights and then you know where this leads.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

The rationale for doing what you do isn't what I'm getting at. What I'm asking you, Jack, is that you said if there is a fee, it's not a right. You pay a fee to CC. Is CC a right? You say about the "fee" that you're forced to pay it. I don't believe you are. You have choices. You could open carry. You could move to a state with constitutional carry. It's about one thing with a fee being not a right, and another thing with a fee still being a right. I don't think it is both ways. Just get a suppressor.

Correct, cc is now not a right. You can't just do it so it clearly isn't a right these days. Is it constitutionally? Yes, is it the law we have let trample it and make it a privilege? Yes. I am not held at gunpoint to pay the fee but I pay that to not be a criminal and am now able to legally defend myself. We are talking about totality of weapons being not able to be carried for cc vs you paying the fee for certain types of guns and a very small number at that regarding nfa. The final part regarding moving to a different state doesn't fix anything, we are discussing Americans rights and not talking about Kentucky. Moving to another state doesn't fix the people of Kentucky from having their rights turned to priveledges.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

[Gunsmokin]

Ok, does that mean carrying your pistol out in the open is a right, but inside your waistband is not?

The way you carry or what you carry should not even be a factor but it is. I have to have the concealed carry for many reasons over open carry but the only way to carry concealed weapons is to do that so I choose to do that. Do I think it is right of them to infringe upon me, no. The big difference in the comparison is guys want these "cool toy" guns mainly and that is the only kind you are paying for permission to have. It isn't like the concealed carry list says I have to pay to carry only select few guns but that I can't carry any gun concealed or knives, brass knuckles etc. I am not paying to carry "modified" guns but any guns. I am not telling anyone else to not do it but am telling you I don't and why. It always gets everybody mad but hey I've been doing it my whole life.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

So, the "Fee" you pay for the "right" to concealed carry is ok? The reason I decided to get into the NFA world is not about "cool toys," but they are cool. The way I think about it is, the more people who have these types of items, the more commonplace it becomes, the more likely the argument that it needs to be less regulated becomes easier to make. Look at suppressors, there is a movement to make them an item you can walk into the LGS and purchase as easy as a pistol or rifle. I don't believe it is likely in my lifetime that it will be that easy, but incremental moves toward that goal is a win for all of us. You cannot look at what has happened in the last couple years and not at least think that these things are more and more common.

No its not ok and I explicitly said that ("Do I think it is right of them to infringe upon me, no.") I said that I was forced to do that or not carry at all vs committing a crime. Not buying a permission slip for a few inch shorter barrel doesn't hinder me shooting any of the many guns I own or want to own. I wish I could join in on your belief of it being commonplace so it would be accepted but we are one election and current generation away from losing lots more gun rights if not all gun rights and then you know where this leads.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

The rationale for doing what you do isn't what I'm getting at. What I'm asking you, Jack, is that you said if there is a fee, it's not a right. You pay a fee to CC. Is CC a right? You say about the "fee" that you're forced to pay it. I don't believe you are. You have choices. You could open carry. You could move to a state with constitutional carry. It's about one thing with a fee being not a right, and another thing with a fee still being a right. I don't think it is both ways. Just get a suppressor.

Correct, cc is now not a right. You can't just do it so it clearly isn't a right these days. Is it constitutionally? Yes, is it the law we have let trample it and make it a privilege? Yes. I am not held at gunpoint to pay the fee but I pay that to not be a criminal and am now able to legally defend myself. We are talking about totality of weapons being not able to be carried for cc vs you paying the fee for certain types of guns and a very small number at that regarding nfa. The final part regarding moving to a different state doesn't fix anything, we are discussing Americans rights and not talking about Kentucky. Moving to another state doesn't fix the people of Kentucky from having their rights turned to priveledges.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

I just disagree that the fee somehow negates the right. An infringement, yes. We all have to do what we have to do to remedy that. That's my point. We are all on the same team here.

[jackalo626]

Ok, does that mean carrying your pistol out in the open is a right, but inside your waistband is not?

The way you carry or what you carry should not even be a factor but it is. I have to have the concealed carry for many reasons over open carry but the only way to carry concealed weapons is to do that so I choose to do that. Do I think it is right of them to infringe upon me, no. The big difference in the comparison is guys want these "cool toy" guns mainly and that is the only kind you are paying for permission to have. It isn't like the concealed carry list says I have to pay to carry only select few guns but that I can't carry any gun concealed or knives, brass knuckles etc. I am not paying to carry "modified" guns but any guns. I am not telling anyone else to not do it but am telling you I don't and why. It always gets everybody mad but hey I've been doing it my whole life.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

So, the "Fee" you pay for the "right" to concealed carry is ok? The reason I decided to get into the NFA world is not about "cool toys," but they are cool. The way I think about it is, the more people who have these types of items, the more commonplace it becomes, the more likely the argument that it needs to be less regulated becomes easier to make. Look at suppressors, there is a movement to make them an item you can walk into the LGS and purchase as easy as a pistol or rifle. I don't believe it is likely in my lifetime that it will be that easy, but incremental moves toward that goal is a win for all of us. You cannot look at what has happened in the last couple years and not at least think that these things are more and more common.

No its not ok and I explicitly said that ("Do I think it is right of them to infringe upon me, no.") I said that I was forced to do that or not carry at all vs committing a crime. Not buying a permission slip for a few inch shorter barrel doesn't hinder me shooting any of the many guns I own or want to own. I wish I could join in on your belief of it being commonplace so it would be accepted but we are one election and current generation away from losing lots more gun rights if not all gun rights and then you know where this leads.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

The rationale for doing what you do isn't what I'm getting at. What I'm asking you, Jack, is that you said if there is a fee, it's not a right. You pay a fee to CC. Is CC a right? You say about the "fee" that you're forced to pay it. I don't believe you are. You have choices. You could open carry. You could move to a state with constitutional carry. It's about one thing with a fee being not a right, and another thing with a fee still being a right. I don't think it is both ways. Just get a suppressor.

Correct, cc is now not a right. You can't just do it so it clearly isn't a right these days. Is it constitutionally? Yes, is it the law we have let trample it and make it a privilege? Yes. I am not held at gunpoint to pay the fee but I pay that to not be a criminal and am now able to legally defend myself. We are talking about totality of weapons being not able to be carried for cc vs you paying the fee for certain types of guns and a very small number at that regarding nfa. The final part regarding moving to a different state doesn't fix anything, we are discussing Americans rights and not talking about Kentucky. Moving to another state doesn't fix the people of Kentucky from having their rights turned to priveledges.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

I just disagree that the fee somehow negates the right. An infringement, yes. We all have to do what we have to do to remedy that. That's my point. We are all on the same team here.

We are in the same team and I am just discussing with you. I don't take disagreements as attacks at all. We do disagree about a right vs a privilege though. If I told you that your right to free speech had now two separate levels and you could say what you wanted at home for free but you had to pay $100 a year to "subscribe" to say it outdoors, does that make it a right? It absolutely does not. A priveledges is something you pay for or can be taken away and that is exactly what has happened to concealed carry. You should be able to carry short barreled, auto, suppressed guns anywhere you want and it be nobody's business but you are instead told you can only do a few of those things if you pay money and jump through hoops. It is all bullshit.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

[Gunsmokin]

Ok, does that mean carrying your pistol out in the open is a right, but inside your waistband is not?

The way you carry or what you carry should not even be a factor but it is. I have to have the concealed carry for many reasons over open carry but the only way to carry concealed weapons is to do that so I choose to do that. Do I think it is right of them to infringe upon me, no. The big difference in the comparison is guys want these "cool toy" guns mainly and that is the only kind you are paying for permission to have. It isn't like the concealed carry list says I have to pay to carry only select few guns but that I can't carry any gun concealed or knives, brass knuckles etc. I am not paying to carry "modified" guns but any guns. I am not telling anyone else to not do it but am telling you I don't and why. It always gets everybody mad but hey I've been doing it my whole life.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

So, the "Fee" you pay for the "right" to concealed carry is ok? The reason I decided to get into the NFA world is not about "cool toys," but they are cool. The way I think about it is, the more people who have these types of items, the more commonplace it becomes, the more likely the argument that it needs to be less regulated becomes easier to make. Look at suppressors, there is a movement to make them an item you can walk into the LGS and purchase as easy as a pistol or rifle. I don't believe it is likely in my lifetime that it will be that easy, but incremental moves toward that goal is a win for all of us. You cannot look at what has happened in the last couple years and not at least think that these things are more and more common.

No its not ok and I explicitly said that ("Do I think it is right of them to infringe upon me, no.") I said that I was forced to do that or not carry at all vs committing a crime. Not buying a permission slip for a few inch shorter barrel doesn't hinder me shooting any of the many guns I own or want to own. I wish I could join in on your belief of it being commonplace so it would be accepted but we are one election and current generation away from losing lots more gun rights if not all gun rights and then you know where this leads.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

The rationale for doing what you do isn't what I'm getting at. What I'm asking you, Jack, is that you said if there is a fee, it's not a right. You pay a fee to CC. Is CC a right? You say about the "fee" that you're forced to pay it. I don't believe you are. You have choices. You could open carry. You could move to a state with constitutional carry. It's about one thing with a fee being not a right, and another thing with a fee still being a right. I don't think it is both ways. Just get a suppressor.

Correct, cc is now not a right. You can't just do it so it clearly isn't a right these days. Is it constitutionally? Yes, is it the law we have let trample it and make it a privilege? Yes. I am not held at gunpoint to pay the fee but I pay that to not be a criminal and am now able to legally defend myself. We are talking about totality of weapons being not able to be carried for cc vs you paying the fee for certain types of guns and a very small number at that regarding nfa. The final part regarding moving to a different state doesn't fix anything, we are discussing Americans rights and not talking about Kentucky. Moving to another state doesn't fix the people of Kentucky from having their rights turned to priveledges.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

I just disagree that the fee somehow negates the right. An infringement, yes. We all have to do what we have to do to remedy that. That's my point. We are all on the same team here.

We are in the same team and I am just discussing with you. I don't take disagreements as attacks at all. We do disagree about a right vs a privilege though. If I told you that your right to free speech had now two separate levels and you could say what you wanted at home for free but you had to pay $100 a year to "subscribe" to say it outdoors, does that make it a right? It absolutely does not. A priveledges is something you pay for or can be taken away and that is exactly what has happened to concealed carry. You should be able to carry short barreled, auto, suppressed guns anywhere you want and it be nobody's business but you are instead told you can only do a few of those things if you pay money and jump through hoops. It is all bullshit.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

Didn't think there was an attack. It's a friendly debate. We are still homies.

[jackalo626]

Ok, does that mean carrying your pistol out in the open is a right, but inside your waistband is not?

The way you carry or what you carry should not even be a factor but it is. I have to have the concealed carry for many reasons over open carry but the only way to carry concealed weapons is to do that so I choose to do that. Do I think it is right of them to infringe upon me, no. The big difference in the comparison is guys want these "cool toy" guns mainly and that is the only kind you are paying for permission to have. It isn't like the concealed carry list says I have to pay to carry only select few guns but that I can't carry any gun concealed or knives, brass knuckles etc. I am not paying to carry "modified" guns but any guns. I am not telling anyone else to not do it but am telling you I don't and why. It always gets everybody mad but hey I've been doing it my whole life.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

So, the "Fee" you pay for the "right" to concealed carry is ok? The reason I decided to get into the NFA world is not about "cool toys," but they are cool. The way I think about it is, the more people who have these types of items, the more commonplace it becomes, the more likely the argument that it needs to be less regulated becomes easier to make. Look at suppressors, there is a movement to make them an item you can walk into the LGS and purchase as easy as a pistol or rifle. I don't believe it is likely in my lifetime that it will be that easy, but incremental moves toward that goal is a win for all of us. You cannot look at what has happened in the last couple years and not at least think that these things are more and more common.

No its not ok and I explicitly said that ("Do I think it is right of them to infringe upon me, no.") I said that I was forced to do that or not carry at all vs committing a crime. Not buying a permission slip for a few inch shorter barrel doesn't hinder me shooting any of the many guns I own or want to own. I wish I could join in on your belief of it being commonplace so it would be accepted but we are one election and current generation away from losing lots more gun rights if not all gun rights and then you know where this leads.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

The rationale for doing what you do isn't what I'm getting at. What I'm asking you, Jack, is that you said if there is a fee, it's not a right. You pay a fee to CC. Is CC a right? You say about the "fee" that you're forced to pay it. I don't believe you are. You have choices. You could open carry. You could move to a state with constitutional carry. It's about one thing with a fee being not a right, and another thing with a fee still being a right. I don't think it is both ways. Just get a suppressor.

Correct, cc is now not a right. You can't just do it so it clearly isn't a right these days. Is it constitutionally? Yes, is it the law we have let trample it and make it a privilege? Yes. I am not held at gunpoint to pay the fee but I pay that to not be a criminal and am now able to legally defend myself. We are talking about totality of weapons being not able to be carried for cc vs you paying the fee for certain types of guns and a very small number at that regarding nfa. The final part regarding moving to a different state doesn't fix anything, we are discussing Americans rights and not talking about Kentucky. Moving to another state doesn't fix the people of Kentucky from having their rights turned to priveledges.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

I just disagree that the fee somehow negates the right. An infringement, yes. We all have to do what we have to do to remedy that. That's my point. We are all on the same team here.

We are in the same team and I am just discussing with you. I don't take disagreements as attacks at all. We do disagree about a right vs a privilege though. If I told you that your right to free speech had now two separate levels and you could say what you wanted at home for free but you had to pay $100 a year to "subscribe" to say it outdoors, does that make it a right? It absolutely does not. A priveledges is something you pay for or can be taken away and that is exactly what has happened to concealed carry. You should be able to carry short barreled, auto, suppressed guns anywhere you want and it be nobody's business but you are instead told you can only do a few of those things if you pay money and jump through hoops. It is all bullshit.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

Didn't think there was an attack. It's a friendly debate. We are still homies.

So stop texting me in the same room and get the round of beer!

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

[Gunsmokin]

Ok, does that mean carrying your pistol out in the open is a right, but inside your waistband is not?

The way you carry or what you carry should not even be a factor but it is. I have to have the concealed carry for many reasons over open carry but the only way to carry concealed weapons is to do that so I choose to do that. Do I think it is right of them to infringe upon me, no. The big difference in the comparison is guys want these "cool toy" guns mainly and that is the only kind you are paying for permission to have. It isn't like the concealed carry list says I have to pay to carry only select few guns but that I can't carry any gun concealed or knives, brass knuckles etc. I am not paying to carry "modified" guns but any guns. I am not telling anyone else to not do it but am telling you I don't and why. It always gets everybody mad but hey I've been doing it my whole life.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

So, the "Fee" you pay for the "right" to concealed carry is ok? The reason I decided to get into the NFA world is not about "cool toys," but they are cool. The way I think about it is, the more people who have these types of items, the more commonplace it becomes, the more likely the argument that it needs to be less regulated becomes easier to make. Look at suppressors, there is a movement to make them an item you can walk into the LGS and purchase as easy as a pistol or rifle. I don't believe it is likely in my lifetime that it will be that easy, but incremental moves toward that goal is a win for all of us. You cannot look at what has happened in the last couple years and not at least think that these things are more and more common.

No its not ok and I explicitly said that ("Do I think it is right of them to infringe upon me, no.") I said that I was forced to do that or not carry at all vs committing a crime. Not buying a permission slip for a few inch shorter barrel doesn't hinder me shooting any of the many guns I own or want to own. I wish I could join in on your belief of it being commonplace so it would be accepted but we are one election and current generation away from losing lots more gun rights if not all gun rights and then you know where this leads.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

The rationale for doing what you do isn't what I'm getting at. What I'm asking you, Jack, is that you said if there is a fee, it's not a right. You pay a fee to CC. Is CC a right? You say about the "fee" that you're forced to pay it. I don't believe you are. You have choices. You could open carry. You could move to a state with constitutional carry. It's about one thing with a fee being not a right, and another thing with a fee still being a right. I don't think it is both ways. Just get a suppressor.

Correct, cc is now not a right. You can't just do it so it clearly isn't a right these days. Is it constitutionally? Yes, is it the law we have let trample it and make it a privilege? Yes. I am not held at gunpoint to pay the fee but I pay that to not be a criminal and am now able to legally defend myself. We are talking about totality of weapons being not able to be carried for cc vs you paying the fee for certain types of guns and a very small number at that regarding nfa. The final part regarding moving to a different state doesn't fix anything, we are discussing Americans rights and not talking about Kentucky. Moving to another state doesn't fix the people of Kentucky from having their rights turned to priveledges.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

I just disagree that the fee somehow negates the right. An infringement, yes. We all have to do what we have to do to remedy that. That's my point. We are all on the same team here.

We are in the same team and I am just discussing with you. I don't take disagreements as attacks at all. We do disagree about a right vs a privilege though. If I told you that your right to free speech had now two separate levels and you could say what you wanted at home for free but you had to pay $100 a year to "subscribe" to say it outdoors, does that make it a right? It absolutely does not. A priveledges is something you pay for or can be taken away and that is exactly what has happened to concealed carry. You should be able to carry short barreled, auto, suppressed guns anywhere you want and it be nobody's business but you are instead told you can only do a few of those things if you pay money and jump through hoops. It is all bullshit.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

Didn't think there was an attack. It's a friendly debate. We are still homies.

So stop texting me in the same room and get the round of beer!

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

Come on over and you can fondle my SBR's.

[jackalo626]

Ok, does that mean carrying your pistol out in the open is a right, but inside your waistband is not?

The way you carry or what you carry should not even be a factor but it is. I have to have the concealed carry for many reasons over open carry but the only way to carry concealed weapons is to do that so I choose to do that. Do I think it is right of them to infringe upon me, no. The big difference in the comparison is guys want these "cool toy" guns mainly and that is the only kind you are paying for permission to have. It isn't like the concealed carry list says I have to pay to carry only select few guns but that I can't carry any gun concealed or knives, brass knuckles etc. I am not paying to carry "modified" guns but any guns. I am not telling anyone else to not do it but am telling you I don't and why. It always gets everybody mad but hey I've been doing it my whole life.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

So, the "Fee" you pay for the "right" to concealed carry is ok? The reason I decided to get into the NFA world is not about "cool toys," but they are cool. The way I think about it is, the more people who have these types of items, the more commonplace it becomes, the more likely the argument that it needs to be less regulated becomes easier to make. Look at suppressors, there is a movement to make them an item you can walk into the LGS and purchase as easy as a pistol or rifle. I don't believe it is likely in my lifetime that it will be that easy, but incremental moves toward that goal is a win for all of us. You cannot look at what has happened in the last couple years and not at least think that these things are more and more common.

No its not ok and I explicitly said that ("Do I think it is right of them to infringe upon me, no.") I said that I was forced to do that or not carry at all vs committing a crime. Not buying a permission slip for a few inch shorter barrel doesn't hinder me shooting any of the many guns I own or want to own. I wish I could join in on your belief of it being commonplace so it would be accepted but we are one election and current generation away from losing lots more gun rights if not all gun rights and then you know where this leads.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

The rationale for doing what you do isn't what I'm getting at. What I'm asking you, Jack, is that you said if there is a fee, it's not a right. You pay a fee to CC. Is CC a right? You say about the "fee" that you're forced to pay it. I don't believe you are. You have choices. You could open carry. You could move to a state with constitutional carry. It's about one thing with a fee being not a right, and another thing with a fee still being a right. I don't think it is both ways. Just get a suppressor.

Correct, cc is now not a right. You can't just do it so it clearly isn't a right these days. Is it constitutionally? Yes, is it the law we have let trample it and make it a privilege? Yes. I am not held at gunpoint to pay the fee but I pay that to not be a criminal and am now able to legally defend myself. We are talking about totality of weapons being not able to be carried for cc vs you paying the fee for certain types of guns and a very small number at that regarding nfa. The final part regarding moving to a different state doesn't fix anything, we are discussing Americans rights and not talking about Kentucky. Moving to another state doesn't fix the people of Kentucky from having their rights turned to priveledges.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

I just disagree that the fee somehow negates the right. An infringement, yes. We all have to do what we have to do to remedy that. That's my point. We are all on the same team here.

We are in the same team and I am just discussing with you. I don't take disagreements as attacks at all. We do disagree about a right vs a privilege though. If I told you that your right to free speech had now two separate levels and you could say what you wanted at home for free but you had to pay $100 a year to "subscribe" to say it outdoors, does that make it a right? It absolutely does not. A priveledges is something you pay for or can be taken away and that is exactly what has happened to concealed carry. You should be able to carry short barreled, auto, suppressed guns anywhere you want and it be nobody's business but you are instead told you can only do a few of those things if you pay money and jump through hoops. It is all bullshit.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

Didn't think there was an attack. It's a friendly debate. We are still homies.

So stop texting me in the same room and get the round of beer!

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

Come on over and you can fondle my SBR's.

What's the entry fee?

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

[Niceguy]

I want to CC a Glock 18.

[Wyldman]

I want to CC a Glock 18.

Now this idea, I like.

Crush, kill, mangle, maim, destroy.

[jackalo626]

I want to CC a Glock 18.

Makes sense.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

[Niceguy]

Full auto Glock 9mm is hands down the most fun thing I've ever shot! Not the most practical thing in the world by any means, but fuuuuuuuuuck thing is fun as hell! And holster availability has to be better than for an auto MP5...haha

[Gunsmokin]

Ok, does that mean carrying your pistol out in the open is a right, but inside your waistband is not?

The way you carry or what you carry should not even be a factor but it is. I have to have the concealed carry for many reasons over open carry but the only way to carry concealed weapons is to do that so I choose to do that. Do I think it is right of them to infringe upon me, no. The big difference in the comparison is guys want these "cool toy" guns mainly and that is the only kind you are paying for permission to have. It isn't like the concealed carry list says I have to pay to carry only select few guns but that I can't carry any gun concealed or knives, brass knuckles etc. I am not paying to carry "modified" guns but any guns. I am not telling anyone else to not do it but am telling you I don't and why. It always gets everybody mad but hey I've been doing it my whole life.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

So, the "Fee" you pay for the "right" to concealed carry is ok? The reason I decided to get into the NFA world is not about "cool toys," but they are cool. The way I think about it is, the more people who have these types of items, the more commonplace it becomes, the more likely the argument that it needs to be less regulated becomes easier to make. Look at suppressors, there is a movement to make them an item you can walk into the LGS and purchase as easy as a pistol or rifle. I don't believe it is likely in my lifetime that it will be that easy, but incremental moves toward that goal is a win for all of us. You cannot look at what has happened in the last couple years and not at least think that these things are more and more common.

No its not ok and I explicitly said that ("Do I think it is right of them to infringe upon me, no.") I said that I was forced to do that or not carry at all vs committing a crime. Not buying a permission slip for a few inch shorter barrel doesn't hinder me shooting any of the many guns I own or want to own. I wish I could join in on your belief of it being commonplace so it would be accepted but we are one election and current generation away from losing lots more gun rights if not all gun rights and then you know where this leads.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

The rationale for doing what you do isn't what I'm getting at. What I'm asking you, Jack, is that you said if there is a fee, it's not a right. You pay a fee to CC. Is CC a right? You say about the "fee" that you're forced to pay it. I don't believe you are. You have choices. You could open carry. You could move to a state with constitutional carry. It's about one thing with a fee being not a right, and another thing with a fee still being a right. I don't think it is both ways. Just get a suppressor.

Correct, cc is now not a right. You can't just do it so it clearly isn't a right these days. Is it constitutionally? Yes, is it the law we have let trample it and make it a privilege? Yes. I am not held at gunpoint to pay the fee but I pay that to not be a criminal and am now able to legally defend myself. We are talking about totality of weapons being not able to be carried for cc vs you paying the fee for certain types of guns and a very small number at that regarding nfa. The final part regarding moving to a different state doesn't fix anything, we are discussing Americans rights and not talking about Kentucky. Moving to another state doesn't fix the people of Kentucky from having their rights turned to priveledges.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

I just disagree that the fee somehow negates the right. An infringement, yes. We all have to do what we have to do to remedy that. That's my point. We are all on the same team here.

We are in the same team and I am just discussing with you. I don't take disagreements as attacks at all. We do disagree about a right vs a privilege though. If I told you that your right to free speech had now two separate levels and you could say what you wanted at home for free but you had to pay $100 a year to "subscribe" to say it outdoors, does that make it a right? It absolutely does not. A priveledges is something you pay for or can be taken away and that is exactly what has happened to concealed carry. You should be able to carry short barreled, auto, suppressed guns anywhere you want and it be nobody's business but you are instead told you can only do a few of those things if you pay money and jump through hoops. It is all bullshit.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

Didn't think there was an attack. It's a friendly debate. We are still homies.

So stop texting me in the same room and get the round of beer!

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

Come on over and you can fondle my SBR's.

What's the entry fee?

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

Ha! $0

[ssracer]

Full auto Glock 9mm is hands down the most fun thing I've ever shot! Not the most practical thing in the world by any means, but fuuuuuuuuuck thing is fun as hell! And holster availability has to be better than for an auto MP5...haha

i concur

[Wyldman]

The 18 is the same pattern as the 17, is it not?

Crush, kill, mangle, maim, destroy.

[Niceguy]

The 18 is the same pattern as the 17, is it not?

Crush, kill, mangle, maim, destroy.

Yes sir... I figure that leaves the options endless.

[Niceguy]

I've had 2 different ones of these and they both functioned 100% and were surprisingly accurate. Good deal today also.